54 replies to this topic

[HalfDemonInuyasha]

Hell thats whats most vexing, Sakura actually subverts at least one tsundere trope in that she doesnt hit Naruto that much at all, 3-4 times max the entire manga. the anime is responsible for adding so many Sit boy moments to her character that she comes off as abusive when the reality is very different

And it's usually Naruto's own idiocy that results in her doing it too, not just "out of nowhere" or anything.

[Phantom_999]

To be frank, Sakura’s character is fine as it is. It was never a problem. It is when there is biased double standards comparing her to Hinata is my issue with the whole thing. Would I like to see Sakura in action more? Sure but I never expected too much out of it and what we got is fine.

[Bryon_Konoha_Ninja]

To be frank, Sakura’s character is fine as it is. It was never a problem. It is when there is biased double standards comparing her to Hinata is my issue with the whole thing. Would I like to see Sakura in action more? Sure but I never expected too much out of it and what we got is fine.

True. It just sometimes is a damn shame. But it can't be helped.

[Bail o' Lies]

And it's usually Naruto's own idiocy that results in her doing it too, not just "out of nowhere" or anything.

That's the point and why it suppose to be taken as comedic. A character does something stupid or inappropriate and gets punished so the audience can laugh at them is one of the most basic set up in any form of comedy.

 

The thing is why the Japanese understood this. The US fans never had a problem with Naruto's behavior partially due to his background so just saw it as Sakura abusing Naruto. Not helped by certain sub-cultures in the US that influence opinions to help make Sakura hated.

Edited by Bail o' Lies, 24 September 2022 - 12:35 PM.

[Phantom_999]

And it's usually Naruto's own idiocy that results in her doing it too, not just "out of nowhere" or anything.

 

In the manga, yes. The anime on the other hand, had filler after filler where Sakura did indeed hit Naruto for no reason. A prime example I personally remember was that filler arc after the hideout infiltration and failing to take back Sasuke. It was a bit before they first met Sora but Naruto just wanted to sit by Sakura and she took it as invading her personal space for no reason and slapped him several feet away. But take that as you will. Obviously, it is not canon but as we've all stated before the anime is the most exposed form of Naruto media internationally so those filler arcs are influential regardless

Edited by Phantom_999, 26 September 2022 - 11:57 PM.

[Nate River]

To be frank, Sakura’s character is fine as it is. It was never a problem. It is when there is biased double standards comparing her to Hinata is my issue with the whole thing. Would I like to see Sakura in action more? Sure but I never expected too much out of it and what we got is fine.

 

If I had an issue with her, it's on her use. Kishimoto seemed to really struggle finding ways to keep her involved in the plot. Naruto and Sasuke were Part of Team 7, but the core conflict of Part 2 wasn't about Team 7, it was about Naruto and Sasuke and Team 7 one aspect of their lives. I  She cared about them too, but she wasn't part of the metaphysical aspect of their conflict. Kakashi's experience and mentor-type status as well as Obito being one of the final villains kept Kakashi involved, but she really didn't have anything like that either. From a strategic standpoint, having her as a medic was a good idea because in their like a work having medical assistance on site would be invaluable, but it didn't integrate well into a series were combat prowess is often a currency to relevance, especially in Part 2 where be able to fling the biggest jutsu became more and more important. It also didn't help that rather than focused missions that might has multiple fights scattered over the course a mission (like the wave arc), it became more like DBZ in nature.

 

As far as Kakashi training her, I can't recall what I may have through in the past, but now its far more a writing issue than a Kakashi issue. You can make an argument that he sucked, but its clear that Kishimoto was not meaning to convey or even imply it as there is nothing from Sakura that suggest she saw it the way many fans did and as Bail said, its clear off screen training occurred and Kishimoto just never really followed up on it. 

 

It also clear, that by this point he had decided on them having them having individual mentors. People have criticized Kakashi for his treatment of Naruto, but I think Kishimoto just wanted him get set up Jiriaya. The point wasn't supposed to be Kakashi sucks, it was how do I get him to meet Jiriaya. In the process he makes a classic show don't tell mistake. I think in universe Ebisu is supposed to be a legitimately good instructor who is a poor fit for Naruto, but his treatment as a joke character while on screen undercuts this and got Kakashi accused of blowing Naruto off. We only know Ebisu is good because the series says so, the only two people who work with him on screen chafe under him. I've also come to appreciate why Kakashi would focus on Sasuke. He was facing a murderous sociopath who had tried to kill an incapacitated opponent. As awful as Neji was to Hinata, Gaara was worse and Sasuke possessed no method of getting past his shield without Chidori. From Kakashi's POV, what move did Sasuke (at the time) possess that would allow him to even damage Gaara? He didn't have Lee's speed. Without Chidori, Sasuke really didn't have the skill set to take out someone as tanky as Gaara was. I think he should have done more to make sure Naruto was more prepped, but Sakura had no upcoming matches and I think it works both ways. If she really wanted additional training during that time period, she could asked for it. 

[Phantom_999]

Yeah, And again Because of how "DBZ" it became, the value of medics was just undermined in general. But that's just the consequence of it, when you focus on flashy bang bang powers and "who has the bigger gun" so to speak Medics are rendered rather mundane in those situations despite how valuable they are. In general, as a medic Sakura is VERY useful but her practicality is just not appreciated nor valued comparatively speaking in a setting where it's only about which opposition can blow the other to smithereens, kind of like RPGS in general.

Edited by Phantom_999, 01 October 2022 - 10:46 AM.

[LuckyChi7]

Hey guys,  since it's the month of Naruto's birth, and I've recently just got into digital coloring.. So to celebrate I decided to colorize one of my favorite NaruSaku moments in the manga, and I'm sure many of us remembered this one: 

 

https://twitter.com/...FmWPRkj8rzob__A

 

 

I know preferences on the pairings may have changed, but I was feeling nostalgic about everything when i came to Naruto including some of my favorite NaruSaku moments.

Edited by LuckyChi7, 16 October 2022 - 12:08 AM.

[Phantom_999]

Looks great! Although this probably isn’t the thread to post it on.

[Bail o' Lies]

I want to talk about Ebisu's training of Naruto.

 

From what recall it went like this:

He handed Naruto a graph with info of what Kakashi told him of his team and where Naruto's biggest weakness was, chakra control. Which is what he would be focusing on for the month he would have him. 

So he took Naruto to the local hot springs. Showed and explained water walking and when Naruto mess up explained how it was different from tree walking. Of course you could say he was a bit of a kitten as anytime Naruto would fall in he would be scolded by the hot springs water. Which felt was both to motivate Naruto and to get back at him.

With in a short while Naruto was making clear progress. Which impressed Ebisu. Then Jiraiya showed up.

 

The thing is unlike with Kakashi I never felt like what he was explaining to Naruto went completely over his head, or did he get frustrated with Naruto like Kakashi does. If he was given a month I feel he would have went through various chakra control exercises as well as improving Naruto's fundamentals which would have greatly help Naruto in the long run.

 

The problems with him was: Naruto didn't like nor respect him, he did not notice/detect nor could he likely remove the seal Orochimaru placed on Naruto, and while his training would be useful it was not what Naruto needed to defeat Gaara: Toad Summoning and Contacting Kurama.

[TheFirstEvil100]

You know the strange thing is if I could change one thing about this is a few things.

1 Sakura would have passed that way she could have gotten some much needed training.

2 would be Kakashi telling all three they will all have separate teachers.

I say this as they are in a tournament type deal and Kakashi would say none of them should know what the other is learning. You know in the off chance that they could face the member of their own team.

[Bail o' Lies]

You know the strange thing is if I could change one thing about this is a few things.

1 Sakura would have passed that way she could have gotten some much needed training.

2 would be Kakashi telling all three they will all have separate teachers.

I say this as they are in a tournament type deal and Kakashi would say none of them should know what the other is learning. You know in the off chance that they could face the member of their own team.

...I honestly think he would have just stuck them both with Ebisu since that was what Kakashi was going to train them in (water walking) if Gaara wasn't such a danger he had to train Sasuke or he would die.

 

Not like he could ask Kurenia as she had her own students to train.

[BlueStarSaber]

...I honestly think he would have just stuck them both with Ebisu since that was what Kakashi was going to train them in (water walking) if Gaara wasn't such a danger he had to train Sasuke or he would die.

 

Not like he could ask Kurenia as she had her own students to train.

 

The only other thing I can think of if he had her train with maybe someone like anko who could of helped inform her who orochimaru is, so she understands the whole situation going on with him or possibly introduce a teacher with a little medical skills to give her the idea to train in that style of combat or learn about Tsunade. 

[Phantom_999]

It didn't need to be specifically Kakashi but developing Sakura in genjutsu could have been expanded on rather just pass her off as having high aptitude for it. even though Sasuke takes top priority because he's facing Gaara he could still have arranged for Sakura to be trained in the mean time too since she is still expected to go on missions when the tournament was done.  

[Bail o' Lies]

If Naruto was written today I assume Sakura would have been trained during the month break. But due to different standards at the time, it was fine for her to just spend the entire month contemplating and deciding she would have to get serious about training.

 

But, again, I don't find the chunin exam training problem as much of an issue, as the element training during part two. She should have been a part of that and she should have learned wood release. As there is no reason for her not to be trained by Kakashi during that other than either Kishimoto didn't think of it or wanted to focus on Naruto.

Edited by Bail o' Lies, 14 May 2023 - 08:31 AM.